Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Bringing back the much enjoyed open discussion on the Gita, for general public. Proceeds Chapter and verse wise. For the keen student seeking a deep understanding of Krishna’s counsel! Registration necessary.
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Bringing back the much enjoyed open discussion on the Gita, for general public. Proceeds chapter and verse wise. For the keen student seeking a deep understanding of Krishna’s counsel! Registration necessary.

Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby murugans61 » Sat Dec 03, 2011 11:16 pm

Hari OM

Reflections on verse 34 and 35

Life in the body and in the senses is not an end in itself. Senses are there as a tool for the subhuman to become human and help in his evolution. The goal of the human is to evolve into divine, for which the senses are to be transcended. From attachments and aversions, senses get their power. When these dualities are done away with, the senses cease to be enemies. When the life for the individual is converted into life for the Lord, the senses cease to be enemies.

Man’s nature is to have recourse to what gives pleasure and avoid what gives pain. Arjuna’s temporary setback explains this position. Although he is a kshatriya, he tends to avoid his svadharma and tries to follow other’s dharma to avoid pain. Abandoing one’s duty and embracing that of another is harmful. Vacillation of mind is born of weakness and it deprives one more and more creating more mental pressure and fresh vasanas, instead of exhausting the existing ones.Therefore one should always evolve in the makeup best suited to him.

pranams
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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby vignesh » Sun Dec 04, 2011 12:07 pm

Learnings and reflections from V34 &V35.

Sense organs follow the external sense objects and create ripples in our mind such as likes and dislikes, attachments and agitations. While these have a role to play in our day to day life, we should not be totally governed by their spell. We need to use the sense organs as our tool and deploy them with effective mastery over them. When we learn to command them we will not be affected by the dualities of attachment and aversion.

Our inherent nature determine our svadharma. We need to act as per our svadharma, with out sacrficing on universal dharma. Instead of acting as per our svadharma, which helps to exhaust our vasanas, if we act as per paradharma, it will create fresh vasanas in our mind. The mental pressure on us will be more and our overall efficiency of action will come down. Hence it is recommended to act as per our svadharma.

regards
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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby murugans61 » Tue Dec 06, 2011 8:34 am

Hari OM

On this auspicious Gita Jayanthi Day, our prostrations to Lord Krishna, Pujya Gurudev and Pujya Guruji to seek their blessings and knowledge of Bhagavad Gita.

pranams
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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby sganesh0112 » Tue Dec 06, 2011 10:13 am

Regarding the verse 34 and the Karma Chakra, I have a few observations as substantiated by Sw. Madhavanandaji, Acharya, CM, Ranchi, during his Sravan Sadhana about a couple of years back.

Basically Swamiji has given a detail of 8 part Karma chakra as under.

KARMA - PHALA - BHOGA - SANSKARA - VAASANA - SANKALPA - VICHARA - BHAVANA - KARMA and so on,.

Swamiji detailed the karma chakra as, when we do the karma, it will have its phala (if not immediately, in the subsequent births) i.e. we cannot escape the phala and once phala fructifies, we have to enjoy/face the bhoga, while enjoying the phala (bhoga), certain sanskaras are etched, and these sanskaras lead to the impressions or Vaasanas, out of which a new sankalpa is created/generated, and this sankalpa, which is the seed develops into a thought or make us think about the next work to do(i.e. vichara), this vichara leads to a firm conviction or bhavana to do the karma and then we do the action which once again leads to the continuance of the cycle of Karma.

In this cycle, we can control only in the karma part i.e. we can do the action as our duty, and surrender to the Lord, and once we surrender, the re is a reduction in the generation of Vaasana and thus the cycle can be broken. Once the cycle is broken, we can proceed to the next stage of our Saadhana and thus progress in the path for realising the Self.

Regards,

S Ganesh
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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby meera » Sat Dec 10, 2011 5:31 am

Hari Om....


Here are some thoughts after the study of verse 34:


Chapter 3, Verse 34

Synopsis: Man’s chief enemies are his likes and dislikes, his attachments and aversions. They reside in the senses hence man should attempt to control them so that he is their master.

Thoughts define the man. Past thoughts which were entertained repeatedly now become a pattern and operate on their own, like a software that is invoked the moment a computer is booted. In much the same way, the moment man wakes up, these thought patterns which have become second nature to him, play out and control a man, no matter how learned he be. Unless he trains to keep them in control.

Therefore, what he has learnt should now replace old thought patterns by becoming his new thought patterns.
Knowledge is both theoretic and internalised. When it is theoretic, ie at the level of reading and understanding, it is still external to us and not available on demand. It is like a wrist watch kept in the cupboard. When I want to know the time, I have to open the cupboard, get the watch out and then see it. When knowledge is internalised, assimilated, it blends with the man and becomes inherent to him, such that any action and thought is flown over this knowledge and through this knowledge and contains the essence of that knowledge.

As long as knowledge is apart from me, even if it is known to me it is not accessible readily when the moment demands. As such, what gets automatically invoked during thought and action is my lower nature.

The biggest and worst enemy of man is his lower nature. It is the lower nature that keeps man running away from his essential nature towards perfecting something that is not even his. The lower nature has power, unfortunately which it exerts and forces man to believe he is weak and imperfect. Consequently he will, believing this, empower his senses which will take over and lead him towards naam-rupa showing them all as desirable.

The nature of the sense organs is to be attracted to something and averse to others. But this training happens in the mind. It is not the sense organs that cause the agitation – they merely graze in their sense fields. The mind it is that puts them into boxes – ‘like’ and ‘dislike’. So when a thing evokes joy, it is not the thing but the classification of that thing in the mind.

The classification of ‘I like’ and ‘I dislike’ happens BY the mind, IN the mind, and once this classification is ‘saved’ in the mind, it simply replicates this for every experience putting everything into these two boxes and suffers alone.

This why Krishna guides us lovingly as a grandparent would, ‘Let no one come in their sway...’

The imploration is not to abandon and give up everything but to remain in their midst and toughen and train the mind. Krishna wants us to experience everything not helplessly but in control and with mastery of our mind. That control is perfected when we are neither attracted or feel aversion for anything or person.

For this, side stepping the ego and its assumption of greatness is very very crucial. We do not realise (until we separate from it) how dominant the ego has become so that it actually lives for us (the choice of words alone can startle us!), directing even what we may think. That is how we now come to see that likes and dislikes are actually a declaration of the ego based on how it chooses to have us live.

We now see that the ego’s behaviour itself is cosseted by our vasana-s. It is not independently clever, after all! Like a man is a slave to intoxicants, the ego is to the vasana-s. And in between the jiva struggles and suffers.

So there is a three pronged approach suggested for us by Krishna:
a. Give up the thought that pleasure or pain, or like or dislike for objects lies in the objects.
b. The pleasure or pain is resident in the mind and its misunderstanding that it must retaliate with its preferances to protect itself!
c. Mind must be trained to witness, observe and withdraw.

Once the mind is thus trained to withdraw from revelling in the sense world, the ego will die of disuse – because the ego cannot live without the mind.

A thought: I find chapter 3 extremely perfect for man of 21st century, who is keen to climb out of this morass of mind-ego-slavery. Every diktat here is as perfectly timed for us.
Appropriately I come across these words from Pujya Gurudev in the current issue of the Delhi Mission bulletin:

According to Lord Krishna, the essential dynamics of personality are getting wasted in our ordinary regrets of our past, our anxieties for the future and our excitement in the present. The 3rd chapter of the Gita actually reveals an intellectually satisfactory technique by which all these wastages can be stopped and they can be directed into one’s own chosen field of endeavour!
H.H. Swami Chinmayananda
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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby murugans61 » Sun Dec 11, 2011 10:14 pm

Hari OM

CIF is organizing a Maha Gita Quiz on the Bhagavad Gita Facebook page.
The quiz is open till tomo morning 10 am India time.
http://www.facebook.com/#!/notes/bhagavad-gita-course/maha-gita-quiz-on-december-11-2011/270990519616541
You are requested to participate in this quiz program

regards
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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby meera » Tue Dec 13, 2011 5:25 am

Hari Om..


Verse 35

Synopsis: Here Krishna says: it is better to respond to one’s own calling than to do another’s even if the latter is well done. Even if the former earns us nothing.

Krishna has just finished telling us where our likes and dislikes reside and how we may gain control over them. He has just told us that there will be waves called attachments and aversions which will seize our discrimination and how we must see these as not OF the objects and situations, but verily the vikara of our own mind!

Nothing can be simpler in description. Krishna says that which seems compellingly desirable is the acute obsession of the mind to be satiated – verily like a bad sneeze that forces its way out. But man can be deluded into thinking that the desire or satisfaction in fact lies in the object and this is what propels him onward.

Now taking this very reasoning forward Krishna alludes to how this very condition of delusion of the mind leads man to adopting duties that are not his (no matter whose they are) in favour of abandoning his own.

How perfectly He has chosen His words – for He is yet staying in the realms of mental control.

And how may one know what one’s own duty is? By staying quiet with your thoughts, understanding their nature and deriving from them. Duties to oneself arise from one’s inner being, not from people outside. When we examine our thoughts we come to understand the fabric of which we are designed, our wiring. ‘What are the skills and talents that I am fitted with which cause my thoughts to be of a given nature/kind?’ This goes to define each person’s personality. This again arises from his bedrock of vasana-s. If we examine our vasana-s we will understand our duty-profile; if we examine our talent pool, we will understand our vasana-s.

Gurudev has one of the finest definitions for vasana-s: Pre-determined ‘channels-of-thinking’ created by one’s own past ways of thinking.

This definition is both a tool for growth and a suicide pact.

If we do not take stock of the vasana-s that need flushing, we are headed for regression. And yet if we give our Vasana-s a good look, we can know what we need to work with. That will define our SVADHARMA.

Usually, getting to grips with our svadharma can be tough if we do not have this road map from the Gita and Gurudev.

The reason why it is called ‘duty’ arises from the fact that on our onward path towards perfection, we will be shown portions of our vasana-s (from one life to another, as a part of the unfolding of our prarabda) and we have to keep exhausting our vasana-s as apparent to us.

This is in fact a neat game plan. In every life a set of vasana-s reveal, if left unattended, they can cause frustration, if attended to well, they can be employed to design our vocation in life, if channelled productively, they will be exhausted, and we are the better for it.

Which is why in career decisions one must employ the vasana bag to choose the path, for these are already with us to contribute for the yagna of life; but when we choose a career that is outside the ambit of our vasana-s so that we are looking at the fruits possible and thus choosing careers where monetary rewards are higher, then what we are doing are:

a. Choosing someone else’s course of life
b. Not giving to the Yagna what we have come with (like taking naivedyam to the temple and not offering it to the Lord!)
c. Taking away from the yagna what was never ours
d. Taking away from the yagna the possibility to enhance its production
e. Restricting the productive potential of the yagna from flowering.
f. Consequently (and naturally) not exhausting our vasana-s

Therefore svadharma is not hereditary (dad is doctor so I am doctor), and from this we can derive any number of caste, creed etc diktats which we must happily abandon. Svadharma is the dictate of our vasana-s and never mind what our parents did, those of us who are parents and guides must love our wards sincerely and guide them towards their vasana led svadharma.

Naturally comes the rider: If we do so, we are calm, un-agitated, at peace and love shines all round. Imagine the frustration when a child has to choose a career because mummy likes it.

In the same breath, we can see that when we do not do as our mind needs, but we do something else, then we are going against svadharma and doing paradharma.

Para can be seen as ‘another’s dharma’ or easier as ‘other than my dharma’. Although many of us are also guilty of doing another’s dharma.

So when Krishna says para-dharmo bhaya-vahah He means simply and just that: in the performance of another’s dharma there is fear, danger.

Why these adjectives? Because frustration over being unable to be what one is, results in a pressure cooker condition – resulting in destruction to his environment or destruction to himself. Both, undesirable. And the danger of sub optimising the task with our unformed skills for a task we are not wired for. And the resultant damage to ourselves.

And this is what Arjuna was being told too. The idea of sanyas was of course born of inability to face his own challenges and a desire to escape by the shortest road available. But in so doing he would be leaving his own duty as a kshatriya unattended and trying to be (a renunciate) what he does not have the wiring for. Sometimes people take sanyas out of frustration with life’s rewards, and half way down the road feel claustrophobic, unable to be a sanyasi.

That could have been Arjuna’s lot.

That can be our lot if we fail to understand Krishna’s wisdom.

One other strong counsel here from Krishna is this: Even if in performing svadharma the results are imperfect.
This ofcourse is perfectly and utterly in sync with the lessons of Karma Yoga (to duty alone you have right and not to its fruits... therefore our actions must arise from a sense of duty and not the gains from it...) and the yagna theory that Chapter 3 is bursting with which is: this is a yagna, you have been fitted with a wiring that is conducive for this yagna to be glorious.

Therefore offer what you have and thus maximise the realisation of the productive potential of the yagna of life, now that we know this is the true purpose.

We may want excellence and most for ourselves from an action, but that would be most selfish. But if we recognise that the final winner is the yagna and must be the yagna, then we will be more willing to give our inner skills for the yagna even if what it reaps for us as individuals is trivial. A different, yet related analogy would be the driver or cook of the Prime Minister. He may earn very little from the job, but by doing his best in the yagna, what he does for the nation via the PM is immeasurable.

Also, if we attempt to do somebody else’s work (in order to gain their glory, or because we believe that is what we must do) we will bring damage to the yagna by bringing to the work an attitude that is different from what is needed at that moment. Like adding salt to pudding when what is needed is sugar.


Hari Om...
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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby Guest » Tue Dec 13, 2011 9:55 am

Hari Om!

It is yet possible that as individuals we may be able to judge our Svadharma only based on experience. But by the time we are able to know our Svadharma, we may be past our prime and not in a position to decide our career in this world. For, it is basically the parents who should realise their Svadharma and let the children decide their Svadharma. But then, in the present day circumstances is it possible? Can somebody clarify this point based on the present verse.

My personal feel, is that for the parents to know their as well as attend to the Svadharma of their child, the parents must also be acquainted with the Geeta way of life and thought. I am sure, through the present discussions, as a parent and as an individual, I am in the process of understanding the above.

For the Jivatma to realise its goal, this aspect is the foremost part, I think.

Regards,

Ganesh
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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby meera » Wed Dec 14, 2011 5:36 am

Hari Om Ganesh,

Greetings and prayers.

I am no expert but let me share.
I will also request a few acharyas to contemplate on your words and request them to advise all of us here.

Even if parents do not know their career svadharma, it is (by the requirement of their stage-of-life dharma, ie as grihasta-s)important for them to know this much that children are not an extension of their parents but instruments of life who are participating in this huge yagna and hence need to be groomed for life than for parents.

Which is why the greater-good principle should always be uppermost.

You are right, the Geeta is by far the only operating manual that will help everyone to examine their roles. Hence its study must be gently brought about by parents. Even if as a parent I know nothing, knew nothing until now, do I have the inner will to accept the scriptures as my guiding light and start my study today? Even if I am a grandparent now and knew none of this, when I start the study even THIS VERY MOMENT I invest myself with great vasanas.

It is possible that the career I am in may not be perfectly in sync with my vasanas and I realise this late. In the fabric of life late and early are relative. We must examine every action at the moment when it comes up for our evaluation. That at the age of 20 neither my parents nor I knew what I should be doing and we jointly messed up my career choice... that is ok. Right now when I hear Krishna say these words, I can make perfect choices (for life is about making choices). I can choose to smile and say, 'oh-well, now I understand ' and I examine what svadharma can I now allow expression, and then go ahead.

Have we not often heard icons say, "Hold on to your dream"? They refer to svadharma without knowing the word. Svadharma is an inner calling, passion that is unmistakeable. Just that parnetal pressure or peer pressure or our own confusion causes us to choose careers that look pretty, but do not aid the yagna. When we thus make wrong choices we also choose para dharma, for para dharma is not only the dharma of another (like doing somebody else's work), but also refers to dharma that is other than mine.

People are known to learn dance (for example) at the age of 50, and the inner balance they experience as their self rejoices at finding expression, this is what makes them happy, and conseqiuently their families too, who see a different human being!

"Parents must first realise their svadharma": Maybe, but if they did not, that is also ok. I think the important thing here is understanding and internalising this lesson. If even at 70 I realise this, and my svadharma .. I must also develop the faith not to become regretful and unhappy and blame life. Just the inner acceptance that svadharma is where I needed to get to, is enough. So I feel.

But the child, youth, must take this verse 35 of Ch 3 seriosuly and take the help of a good acharya to figure out what is it that is his svadharma.

Not just parents. Teachers. These are the real opinion leaders. Teachers take responsibility for students, morally. Arjuna's archery skills were understood by Guru Drona, not Pandu. The teacher therefore has to have a purity of heart and must be a yagna participant with integrity..... so many factors, Ganesh!

This is a huge yagna. We are all here billions of us. Think of how many people really encounter this moment that tells them to examine their svadharma. With a clear intention in the heart and an Om on the tongue, stand before your Lord and Guru and open your palms to him...to show you the way.


Will get back with an acharya's wisdom here, soon.

Hari Om.
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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby meera » Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:25 pm

Hari Om!

Brni Shruti Chaitanya ji, Puducheri Center (Pondicherry) has replied:

Dear amma,

Hari Om. Pranams.

Have gone through the discussions in the link that amma has sent. Glad to note the sincereity with which you all are trying to know and internalise the knowledge. The word svadharma is looking like taking a turn in your derivations from duty to vasana prompted work and hence the doubt. (may be i am looking that way. ignore it if it is so). Please do modify as you want and put it in, to make it simple and clear.

Verse no 33 to 35 can be seen as dealing with how to come over likes and dislikes.


Summary:


Verse 33 – People act according to their nature. (Question: Is shaastra meaningless?)
Verse 34 – Shaastras are not meaningless. They point out that my nature is built by me myself. So do not come under the sway of raga and dvesha. Slowly we got to reduce our strong likes and dislikes into preferences. Eg. Would you like to have milk or buttermilk ? ‘Dont mention milk. I feel like puking.’ (strong dislike) ‘i prefer buttermilk. (preference).

Verse 35: How is the above possible? Through swadharma.

This verse is interpreted in two ways.

From Karma yoga standpoint: (normal stand)

Better is ones own dharma, though appearing meritless than the dharma of others though well performed. In fact it is better to die in ones own dharma. Other persons dharma is fraught with fear.

Svadharma means sva kartavyam – duties enjoined on me by my parents, teachers etc. Actions should not be in accordance with likes and dislikes (vasana anusaari), but in accordance with kartavya karma (shaastra anusaari).

Generally no job is meritless. A CEO or a sweeper. A sweepers sweeping job may not appear glamourous, but do your job. Saint Gnaneshwar says ‘your wife may not be beautiful. But better to be with her than to go for another mans beautiful wife’ Remaining steadfast in performance of ones duty, you get rid of your likes and dislikes. As someone in the group pointed out, we are in one big yagna. Each one needs to play their part well. We should not stop saying what if among millions of people, one myself does not play. In performance of duty alone there is beauty. If as brahmacharini of the mission, i open a sweet stall in the centre and sit for its sale, if not fear-giving, it is surely laughable.

Every step, let us ask ourself whether we are doing our duty. As child, i am in school and my duty is to study. Whichever school my parent has put me in, which ever teacher... no complaints. Study more. Should not assume that i must participate in all strikes/protests in school.

What if my strong vasanas are for being a musician, but i am in an operation theater as a surgeon. Ask yourself who you are? Answer is doctor/surgeon. Do your job well. By doing well, i start liking what i am doing. Also in free time you will automatically give field for your desire to sing. If your answer for the question is 'i am a music lover' - get out and do something for music full time and take surgery as your part time work to be done. I am a doctor and a music lover - Think which role is going to give maximum benefit to maximum people for maximum time. i.e. choose the higher role and go in for that.

Someone in the group has pointed out that there are two aspects – our own nature and knowledge we gain. According to vasana acting is general. Our spiritual sadana is to put into practice our knowledge.

Eg. I know that there is no use of getting angry, but i still get angry.
Does it mean that knowledge is useless? Contradiction between knowledge and action is when knowledge is not assimilated. We got to make our knowledge our nature. Actions will be in accordance with my knowledge then and there is no problem.

From jnaana yoga standpoint: (higher stand)

This is absolutely for a spiritual seeker and not for one who wants to bring efficiency and satisfaction in world related pursuits.

Svadharma (svaswaroopa darshane) – our swaroopa (true nature) as sat chit ananda brahma.

Paradharma – identification with Body mind and intellect.

How to get rid of raga and dvesha?

Give up paradharma and abide in your swadharma. It may appear difficult (viguna). Giving up our identification with pains and comforts of the body or the attachment to children and going for a spiritual camp though not likable is many times better than moving around among attachments.

Nidhanam shreyaH – death is better. Death of ego is sure to happen in the realisation and abidance in own self.

Paradharmo bhayavaH – In paradharma, there is fattening of ego. In swadharma there is paramaananda.

Thus we are asked to spiritualise our life to get rid of raga and dvesha.

Svadharme (svasvaroopa darshane), nidhanam shreyaH (ahamkaara nidhanam shreyaH)

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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby uma » Mon Dec 19, 2011 5:06 pm

Hari Om. Pranam to all.

What a lovely and lively discussion! It was a pleasure to read the postings.

I have gathered from the discussions that the following participants are active and in Category No 1. In case, anyone else wishes to participate actively, you are always welcome!

Muruganji will be attending Atmabodha Camp till 3 rd Jan, hence he has not been assigned any posting this time.

Let us move onto Verses 36 - 39.

Verse 36 - Vigneshaji
Verse 37 - Meeraji
Verse 38 - Uma
Verse 39 - Ganeshaji

HGRR Thoughts and Concepts

No 37, 38 - Sathiavatiji
No 39 - Vigneshaji
No 40 - Uma

Verses for memorisation

For all

Verse 39


Regards

uma
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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby vignesh » Wed Dec 21, 2011 8:11 am

Verse 36

Atha kena prayuktoyam papam carati purusah
Anicchann-api varsneya balad-iva niyojitah

Atha-new, kena – by what, prayuktah – impelled, ayam –this, papam – sin; carati – does; purusah – man; anicchan – not wishing, api – even; varsneya – O Varsneya, balat – by force, iva- as it were, niyojitah – constrained.

But, O Krishna ( Varsneya), impelled by what does man commit sin, though against his wishes, constrained, as it were, by force?

HGRR No 39

“Desire itself, under certain circumstances, gains expression as anger”. Explain
Whenever emotions for acquisition and possession of an object flow incessantly towards the object, the bundle of thoughts so flowing is called ‘desire’; while the same desire,when it gets obstructed from reaching its desired objects and gets refracted at an intermediate obstacle is called “anger”.

regards
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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby Guest » Wed Dec 21, 2011 11:29 pm

VERSE 39
AAVRUTTHAM JNANAMETHENA JNANINO NITYAVAIRINA
KAAMARUPENA KAUNTEYA DUSHPOORENA ANALENA CHA

Enveloped, O Son of Kunti, is ‘wisdom’ by this constant enemy of the wise in the form of ‘desire’, which is difficult to be appeased, like fire.
Aavruttham Jnanamethena – Enveloped is wisdom,
Jnaninonityavairina-Constant enemy of the wise
Kaamarupena – In the form of desire
Kaunteya – O Son of Kunti
Dushpoorena – which is difficult to be appeased
Analena cha – like fire

Poojya Gurudev continues to explain this stanza thus –
“ This stanza vividly explains to us that discrimination (Jnana) the capacity to distinguish the Real from the unreal, the permanent from the impermanent, the true from the false, which gives man his higher status in the scale of evolution – is the divine faculty that gets screened off from us due to our own greedy and insatiable desires (In Mahabharata “desire” is described as insatiable. “Desires can never be satiated by the gratification of desires. The more they are enjoyed, the more they grow, as fire by the pouring of ghee into it.”) . The pronouns in the previous stanza now stand clearly elucidated: the “discriminative capacity” in us (it-idam) gets screened off by the insatiable “desires” (by this – tena)”

In the next stanza “Bhagawan tells us which are the seats of ‘Desire’, which, by enveloping wisdom, forms the enemy of the whole world. The seat of the enemy being known, it is easy to kill it”


Ganesh
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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby uma » Thu Dec 22, 2011 11:05 am

Hari Om. Pranam.

Posting Verse 38 and HGRR - Thoughts and Concepts 40

धूमेना व्रियते वन्हिर्यथादर्शो मलेन च ।
यथोल्बेनावृतो गर्भस्तथा तेनेदमावृतं ॥

dhumena vriyate vanhir-yatha-darsho malena cha |
yatholbenaavruto garbhastathaa tenedamavrutam ||38||

धुमेना - dhumena - by smoke, आव्रियते - aavriyate - is enevloped, वन्हिः - vanhih - ifre, यथा - yatha - as, आदर्शः - adarshah - a mirror, मलेन - malena - by dust, च - cha - and, यथा -yatha - as, उल्बेन - ulbena - by the womb, आवृतः - avrutah - enveloped, गर्भः - garbhah - embryo, तथा - tatha - so, तेन - tena - by it, इदं - idam - this, आवृतं - aavrutam -enveloped

38. As fire is enveloped by smoke, as a mirror by dust, as an embryo by the womb, so this (wisdom) is enveloped by that (desire or anger)

HGRR - Thoughts and Concepts

40. Shri Krishna uses three examples to illustrate the manner in which desire and anger veil one's reason and discrimination. What are the three examples and explain their significance.

धूमेना व्रियते वन्हिर्यथादर्शो मलेन च ।
यथोल्बेनावृतो गर्भस्तथा तेनेदमावृतं ॥

dhumena vriyate vanhir-yatha-darsho malena cha |
yatholbenaavruto garbhastathaa tenedamavrutam ||38||

As fire is enveloped by smoke, as a mirror by dust, as an embryo by the womb, so this (wisdom) is enveloped by that (desire or anger)

Desires fall under three categories according to the quality of the attachment - inert (tamasic), or active ( rajasic), or noble and divine (sattvic)/ all the three types of desires veil one's wisdom. These different types of qualities (gunas) are indicated by the following three different examples :

(1) "Fire enveloped by smoke" - signifies wisdom eneveloped by sattva. A passing breeze or slight effort is sufficient to remove the smoke. so too a little effort is sufficient to remove sattvic desires that cloud our wisdom.

(2) " A mirror covered by dust" - indicates wisdom covered by rajas. Just as effort of wiping is required to remove the dust, so too one needs to put in a little more effort to remove rajasic desires.

(3) " The embryo covered by the womb" - indicates wisdom covered by tamas. Effort alone is incapable of freeing the baby from the womb. It takes time and patience to be free of tamasic desires. (3.38)

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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby sganesh0112 » Thu Dec 22, 2011 8:14 pm

VERSE 39
AAVRUTTHAM JNANAMETHENA JNANINO NITYAVAIRINA
KAAMARUPENA KAUNTEYA DUSHPOORENA ANALENA CHA

Enveloped, O Son of Kunti, is ‘wisdom’ by this constant enemy of the wise in the form of ‘desire’, which is difficult to be appeased, like fire.
Aavruttham Jnanamethena – Enveloped is wisdom,
Jnaninonityavairina-Constant enemy of the wise
Kaamarupena – In the form of desire
Kaunteya – O Son of Kunti
Dushpoorena – which is difficult to be appeased
Analena cha – like fire

Poojya Gurudev continues to explain this stanza thus –
“ This stanza vividly explains to us that discrimination (Jnana) the capacity to distinguish the Real from the unreal, the permanent from the impermanent, the true from the false, which gives man his higher status in the scale of evolution – is the divine faculty that gets screened off from us due to our own greedy and insatiable desires (In Mahabharata “desire” is described as insatiable. “Desires can never be satiated by the gratification of desires. The more they are enjoyed, the more they grow, as fire by the pouring of ghee into it.”) . The pronouns in the previous stanza now stand clearly elucidated: the “discriminative capacity” in us (it-idam) gets screened off by the insatiable “desires” (by this – tena)”

In the next stanza “Bhagawan tells us which are the seats of ‘Desire’, which, by enveloping wisdom, forms the enemy of the whole world. The seat of the enemy being known, it is easy to kill it”


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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby sathiavathi » Fri Dec 23, 2011 1:59 pm

VERSE--36
The very question shows Arjuna's change in his attitude towards happenings. He is getting out of the hasty conclusions to a higher level. Every one intellectually knows what is wrong and what is right. But when action comes one invariably gets tempted to do the wrong.This confusion between one's idealogy and one's action becomes a big problem to all those who try to review themselves. The divine in us with its nobler aspirations, wants to fulfil itself with its higher impulses
and subtler achievements, but the animal instinct in us tempts us away and we walk the path of the baser joys of the world. Arjuna wants to know the name of the satan who loots away the divine in us.
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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby sathiavathi » Fri Dec 23, 2011 2:06 pm

HARI OM

VERSE--37
The spiritual ignorance expressinng itself as desire is the inner satan in our bosom. Desire is a constant agitation in our mind caused by an uncontrollable impatience to gain some thing. In life when we are in contact with a variety of objects our mind forms some likings with some objects.These likings produces a desire to possess it. Than we make efforts to possess the object. When we get obstructed from reaching the desired objects anger is formed.This desire-anger-emotion is the very satan in us that compels us to compromise with our higher values of existance, and tempts us to perpetrate sins.Greater the desire, greater we are pulled towards sin. Once the desire comes to manifest our intellect, it enshrouds the wishdom in us. Lord advices Arjuna to come out of this desire, anger,
sin, and sorrow situations and to act with wishdom.
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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby sathiavathi » Fri Dec 23, 2011 2:12 pm

HARI OM

VERSE---38
Desire and consequent anger choke our reasoning power of discrimination in us. They hide the divine in us.These desires can fall under three different categories.
Lord Krishna has given three examples to distinguish between the different textures in the veils that come to hide our true self.
1-Sattwic desires- Noble and divine desires to strive and achieve diviner perfection and a godly self illumination.Krishna compares these desires as fire by smoke.In a smoky fire place the smoke partially veils the
brillience of the light emitted by the flames.Smoke rolls of even at a passing whiff of breeze.However thick the smoke might be, the fire can be perceived.Similarly, it is easy for a sattwic to remove the veil and be
with the divine self.
2--Rajasic desires- They strive to achieve power and wealth, to gain strength and might, to win fame and glory.These desires are compared as a dust on a mirror.The removal of dust on a mirror is little more difficult.
It can be polished by our own efforts at dusting it clean with the help of a clean and dry duster. If the dust is thick no reflection at all can be seen in the mirror.Similarly rajasik desires can be removed by our own efforts only.
3-Tamasic desires are low and vicious and the mind crave for fleshy and carnal pleasures.These are compared as the foetus in the womb.The foetus is covered by the womb until it matures.We cannot observe it as long as it is in the womb.The veiling is complete, and it can drop off only after a definite periode of time. Similarly, desire for flesh-fleshy enjoyments build a womb around the discriminative power in us. Such low mental
pre-occupations can drop off only after a longer periode of evolutionary growth undergone by such a deluded mind and intellect.
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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby sathiavathi » Fri Dec 23, 2011 2:17 pm

HARI OM

VERSE--39
Our desires can never be get satisfied.The more they are enjoyed the more they grow.The desires are the enemy of our wishdom.The power of discrimination the capacity to distinguish the real from the unreal,
the permenent from the impermenent, the true from the false, which gives man his higher status in the scale of evolution.This discriminative capacity in us is gets screened off from us due to our own greedy and insatiable desires.
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Re: Gita Study Group : Chapter 3 : Karma Yoga

Postby uma » Fri Dec 23, 2011 2:52 pm

Hari Om Satiavathiji, Pranam.

You were requested to post Thoughts and Concepts No 37 and 38 from Holy Geeta Reference Book.

Generally the procedure is, we post allotted verses and excerpts from Geeta and Holy Geeta Reference Book and when the posting is complete, each one gives her/his own reflection.

Do you have the Holy Geeta Reference book ? Otherwise I will post it on your behalf.

Regards

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